“I Kneel only to God and Woman”

[The One Man Gang]

John E. Ward, American Minister to the Dragon Throne of China, 1859.

President James Buchanan had dispatched the Georgia native to Peking to deliver the ratified copy of the Treaty of Tientsin to the Chinese government.  Meetings to hammer out the final details ensued with a pair of Chinese commissioners.

http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/ah/1961/1/1961_1_94.shtml

The barbarian’s mode of transportation, however, was of far less importance than the form of the Ta-li, or Great Rite—the ceremony he would be required to perform at his audience with the Emperor. From time immemorial, of course, all who entered the Great Interior to behold the Dragon’s Face were required to kowtow. The entire ceremony consisted of kneeling three times and knocking the forehead on the ground three times at each kneeling. Whether Ward might have reservations about kowtowing was unknown, but if so, perhaps the required number of prostrations could be reduced. This would be a matter for the most careful negotiation.

<snip>

“Before the treaty is exchanged,” Kweiliang observed, “it will be necessary to have an audience with His Majesty, who desires to evince his friendliness … We must consult together beforehand upon the manner of presentation at court, and it will be proper for you to practice the ceremonies used at an audience before the day appointed.”

Dr. Williams had warned Ward that the matter of the audience would be brought up, for Judge Sieh had mentioned it to him in a brief visit to the legation the day before. And the ceremony was well known, as was the fact that the Chinese required that it be rehearsed several days beforehand. Ward replied:

In reference to an audience with His Majesty, I think it is highly important that I see him, not only on account of the respect shown thereby to my country, but the manner of my reception will do much to exhibit to the world the policy of the Chinese Government and enable the world to judge whether the proceedings of the English are right or not. [This was a reference to the British attempt to bring warships up the river.] I wish, too, to honor the Emperor and show him the same respect that I show to the President, which I have been instructed to do. In approaching him, therefore, I will observe such ceremonies and forms of obeisance as he may prescribe, except that I will not kneel or knock my head on the ground before him, for those attitudes are confined with us to religion and are not used in coming before the President or before the ruler of any other country. In other respects I will accord with Chinese etiquette.

<snip>

Besides, the kowtow was simply compliance with the rigid body of ritual law which governed the social relationships between all people, from the lowest peasant to the Emperor, who himself performed the kowtow many times when he made sacrifices to Heaven or worshipped the Goddess of the Silkworms. Did this American barbarian now in Peking consider himself equal to the Son of Heaven?

The question probably never entered the mind of John Elliott Ward. He was, however, no less proud than the titled nobility representing other Western countries who had preceded him to Peking in years past. A native of Georgia, descended from the Scottish Highlanders who settled in the state in Oglethorpe’s time, Ward had been a reform mayor of Savannah and later president of the Democratic National Convention which nominated Buchanan for President.

<snip>

At this point, Dr. Williams’ journal reveals, Hwashana asked Ward just what kind of ceremony he was willing to perform. The same thing he would do before a European sovereign, Ward answered: he would stand during the audience, covered or uncovered as the Emperor desired, though the latter indicated more respect; would bow as low as His Majesty required; would not sit unless asked to, and would never turn his face from the Emperor. But he stressed again that he could not observe rites reserved for religion.

“I kneel only to God and woman,” he said firmly.

<snip>

Now Ward had said he would bow as low as the Emperor wished. And the one he had performed for them was indeed a very low bow. But he’d said nothing about touching the ground.

Judge Sieh burst out, “It is only three inches more!”

Only three inches. Ward discussed it with his staff.

“Only three inches!” Judge Sieh cried. “What does that signify to make so much discussion!” And he advanced what he considered the clinching argument: Ward could tell the President anything he liked about the kind of ceremony he performed.

Yes, Ward said drily, that might do, for it was done all the time in China. But, he added, Americans observed a different code of conduct. And as for touching the ground with his fingers, though it was but three inches more, he would not do it.

When Judge Sieh walked out of that house “wearied and disappointed” at 4 P.M. on August 5, 1859, eleven hundred years of history came to a close. During that time the Chinese had brought to their knees the Arabs, the Dutch, the Russians, the Portuguese, and the British. But they had never met a free, independent American from the proud state of Georgia.

After John E. Ward had refused to kowtow or kneel or even to go those last three inches and touch his fingers to the ground, an audience with the Emperor was out of the question. But the Chinese never again made such a demand of a Western envoy. The next time the question came up, in 1873, the Ministers of the United States, Britain, France, Russia, and the Netherlands came before the Emperor bowing low once on entering the throne room and then three times before retiring backwards.

Note that at this time and ever since it has been UNTHINKABLE that an American Head of State (for you Democrats out there, that would be the President) would EVER do more than a polite bob of the head to a foreign HoS. 

So how does our current POTUS handle such issues?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JGK-xbXxMw

Given the shiaterain from the Drive-Byes when President George W. Bush took then-Crown Prince Abdullah's hand as they strolled the grounds of Bush's Crawford, Texas, ranch during a state visit, with dark ruminations on how this showed he was in the Saudis' back packet, etc. ...

http://www.slate.com/id/2117517/

Surely, had the Drive-Byes witnessed this obsequious act by President Hopenchange they would have gone completely bonkers.

Oh, wait, THEY WERE THERE!!! This was a press-covered event.

To paraphrase the article: Two hundred thirty-two years, eight months and two days of American History have come to a close.

OK. Now go throw up.

[Shimmy]

This will be passed off as not very important, but I think it is one of the most important stories of this clown's tenure as President.

[TheAngryVoice]

When an American president travels abroad, he represents the American people. When Lamont bows down to these clowns, America bows.
Nice job Lamont, we`ve gone from being somebody to being somebodys bitch.

[NCVol]

Is life so shitty as a republican that you REALLY have to spend every waking moment finding stuff about Obama to be outraged about?  Is there really nothing more serious than a BOW that you can worry about?  Say, the coming depression, and what to do about it? 

What this looks to me like is the signs of a dying party on its last breath.  Good riddance. 

[The One Man Gang]

Are you really such an absolute dimbulb that you do not recognize the implications when an AMERICAN president bows from the waist before before a third-world despot?

Is it possible, just possible, that that particular photo will be shown in every Islamist hellhole on the planet to prove that the "Great Satan" has been humbled and now lies open to any attack or strategem they wish to bring to bear?

It's not bad enough that Hopenchange is arrogant.

It's not bad enough that Hopenchange is inept and incompetent.

It's not bad enough that Hopenchange is a Socialist.

He's an arrogant, inept, and incompetent Socialist.

(Apologies to Dick Morris)

[LTC]

Is life so shitty as a republican that you REALLY have to spend every waking moment finding stuff about Obama to be outraged about?  Is there really nothing more serious than a BOW that you can worry about?  Say, the coming depression, and what to do about it? 

What this looks to me like is the signs of a dying party on its last breath.  Good riddance. 

Yeah...life is that shitty if you are a wingnut republican.

Protocol....




Paranoia runs rampant in Wingnuttia!

[Kenny D from Halls]

LTC I see nothing wrong with KB II helping release a little tension.......

[LTC]

Of course you don't!

[The One Man Gang]

This will be passed off as not very important, but I think it is one of the most important stories of this clown's tenure as President.

Truer words have not been spoken on this board.

Ever.

Just read the reaction of the "Hopenchange-rs" to this.

The fact that TR's spirit did not rise up out of his crypt on Sagamore Hill, go to London, and kick Hopenchange's skinny butt until his ears rang proves that even the ghosts of America's greatness realize it's over.

[Sasquatch]

Is life so shitty as a republican that you REALLY have to spend every waking moment finding stuff about Obama to be outraged about?  Is there really nothing more serious than a BOW that you can worry about?  Say, the coming depression, and what to do about it? 

What this looks to me like is the signs of a dying party on its last breath.  Good riddance. 

I thought the same thing when the dems went ape shiit over this:



I also wondered how shitty life was as a democrat when you had to fabricate stories to try to steal an election:

[plumbervol]

I could never be a diplomat, I know I would never bow to her damn queeness or to the Saudi royals. Reality is that over the years US diplomats have had to adapt. John Adams did the protocol and even Jackson had to fight with the issue. I liked George Bush seniors approach, he threw up on the Japanese.

I wondered about height and the issue of what is a bow. George is listed from everywhere from 5-10 to 6'1/2". Obama goes from 6' to 6'2 according to what source you read. I do know George was eye to eye with the Saudi. BO seemed to tower over him. George bowed to get an award placed around his neck. But George went full tilt to the queen of England. George also kissed the Saudi and held hands with him on a walk.

I am a Fenian, I would hold bowing and a curtsy to her Queeness as more of an offense than bowing to the Saudi, or kissing and holding his hand. Diplomacy requires kissing skills..... Reality of the job....

Another reality is that the Saudi supported the taliban and one day the Sheik or whoever follows him will be responsible for toppling the Saudi royals. Guess what someone who actually is related to OBL will bring his money and family to the US and will be welcomed.  They will assume the position of not paying their damn TAXES and screwing hard working Americans while REPUBLICANS will kiss their asses and ensure they are treated like ROYALTY in AMERICA.....

[Kenny D from Halls]

This should make the Dims feel better.....